con is so fine, it is so fine to eat some swine. it's bacon peaks and baking, bacon, it's so fine to eat some swine. its stake in. it's "outfront" next, shocking announcement out of the vatican today. plus a power struggle in the republican party. in the end, who will be the voice of the gop? somebody might die in this fight. will rubio win or somebody like rand? >> and ted nugent has been invited to attend tomorrow's state of the union address. we have a preview of what he might say in a special report. let's go "outfront." good evening. everyone. i'm erin burnett. tonight, the fourth most

powerful man in the world resigns. pope benedict xvi surprised many of his 1.2 billion fall ors worldwide when he said he was going to step down at the end of the month, and the reason, his age. nearly one in four americans identifies as catholic. according to the church, the catholic population worldwide has about 15 million members in 2010. the latest year for which there was data. about 17% of the planet is catholic. now, a church is believed to be the third largest landowner in the world, so it's hard to estimate what the church owns and what it's worth. economists estimate annual spending just by the united states by the catholic church and its entities was about $170 billion in one year, 2010. sister simone campbell is the executive director of the national catholic justice lobby. brian finny worked for opus dei.

scary guys. let me start with you, sister simone. i wart to start with a serious issue. $3.3 billion has been paid out by the church in the past 15 years to settle rape and molestation charges of boys against priests. pope benedict has been accused of failing to act by some. the executive director of the survivors network of those abused by priests spoke. he said, quote, when forced to, he talked about the crimes but ignores the cover-ups. uses the past tense as to suggest it's not still happening. he has vast powers and he's done very little to make a difference. is that true? >> i don't know exactly what the pope has done to atone for what's happened. i do know that this has been a scandal in our church, but worst of all, it has been -- caused serious harm to children for many years. and that we as a church need to atone for that.

paying money is one thing, but we all know that doesn't make up or atone for the sin of these crimes against children. we have a lot still to do. we need leadership that will engage that issue. >> and do you think, brian, that the next pope needs to be active on this? there are still cases now in this country where there are priests who abuse children and there were people, perhaps, at the highest level of the vatican, who covered up for that. >> i think the next pope absolutely needs to be sensitive to this, but he also needs to be recognized that pope benedict was the first pope to meet with victims of sex abuse. he was a pope who pushed through new procedures so the church would be sensitive to the needs of victims. so i think a tremendous amount has been done, and the church will continue to try to be sensitive to the needs of victims. >> all right, i want to ask about a couple of other issues and i want to start the issue of home sexualty and same sex marriage. here, 1 in 4 americans identify themselves as catholic, and in catholics in the united states

of america, 54% of them support gay marriage. clearly, the will of the catholic people in the united states is in favor of gay marriage, not the church. isn't it time for the church, which is supposed to be an inclusive, generous. giving organization, to move ahead on gay rights? >> the reality is almost every single time, there has been one case in which gay marriage was put to the voters and the voters actually supported gay marriage. when people are educated on the issue and have a chance to reflect on it, people will vote against it. part of the -- >> you think in the united states, the tide is going to turn back and people are going to go against gay marriage? >> i can't prognosticate for the future, but what i do know as a catholic and what i believe as a human being is it's good for a child to be able to experience the love of both a mother and a father. and the love of a mother and a father is irreplaceable. and also, if we start tinkering with marriage, i think we're going off in very dangerous directions. so i would think we should be very cautious in doing that.

>> even if they love each other, isn't the catholic church supposed to be about love? >> yes, the catholic church is about love, and the catholic church is about telling all of us that we should love in a genuine way and a way which is good for the other human being and a way which is good for families. what the catholic church is saying is that this indeed in the end is not good for families, is not good for society. but at the same time, it is -- the catholic church does recognize that gays have inherent human dignity. >> it's hard to say they have inherent human dignity and then say they can't be part of your church. sister simone, why don't you jump in? is this going to be a deal breaker? >> i would love to jump in. i think the challenge is our church looks at it from the hierarchy's perspective, but we live in a plurallistic world, and we know that jesus said go, teach all, and love is the measure for all we love all, and it's that welcoming embrace that

we need as a church, not censure and judging each other. jesus did not judge, so i urge our leaders to be as christ was, the welcoming part of faith, and that's where we need to move. not in judging and creating lines that divide and separate. that's wrong. >> and brian, are you willing to lose people over this issue? i was raised catholic. a lot of people i know were, and most of them are no longer practicing. some have to do with women's rights, but a lot has to do with the stance on gay marriage. >> the church embraces the spirit of the times are the churches that are losing numbers. and so what the catholic church needs to do, the catholic church needs to say, christ calls you to love. to love him, you have to love all of humanity. and it calls you -- part of that is conversion as well.

with respect to homosexuality, the church is saying there are forms of behavior that are not constructive, but we love you and we can work with you. that's what the church is trying to say. >> i want to move on quickly before we go to one other issue, sister simone, the issue of women. why a lot of people have been frustrated with this church in this country that have abandoned it. can there ever be a change? you're sister simone. what about having a priest that was a woman? what about the symbol that that would send to little girls? >> i actually grew up as a young girl and played mass with my sister, and i didn't realize as a girl that i couldn't do it. so i have a long history of thinking we are leaders within our church. i do think that there's room for reconsidering this issue. when you look at the artifacts and the early writings, women were deacons in the early church. women provided leadership. women celebrated sacraments with

the people. so i think we can return to our early roots as opposed to the middle ages where there was more of an emphasis on the patriarchy. if we recovered our real heritage, women would once again be in their rightful place. >> thank you, and before we go, in a word, women priests? back before the middle ages, women had more rights. >> they have to follow the rites of only having men ordained. we have to be faithful to christ. >> thank you very much. please share your point of view with us. obviously, two very different points of view tonight. still to come, some say there's a civil war in the republican party. who will call the shots for the gop, or will it splinter into oblivion? plus, the girl murdered in chicago. why is it taking so long to find her killer? and joe paterno's family calls a investigation into the penn state child sex scandal

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our second story "outfront," civil war in the gop between donald trump calling karl rove a

total loser and the dueling republican responses to the president's state of the union address tomorrow night, what is really going on in the gop? here is how senator rand paul who is giving tomorrow's tea party response, the president puts it, with a touch of diplomacy. >> there's a lot of energy that still comes from the tea party. while they consider themselves mostly to be republican, they occasionally will chastise even the republican establishment, so they want an independent voice. >> chastise, that's a polite way of saying what is happening recently. bob mcdonnell, great to see you. really appreciate your taking the time. >> thank, erin. >> it has been pretty interesting watching the republican party recently. a little bit like watching, perhaps, a pay-per-view wrestling match. rand paul and marco rubio, two rebuttals to the president from one party. is that a good or bad thing for the party? >> we're not a monolithic party. we have a diversity of opinions just like they do in the democratic party.

the president is in the more liberal wing, and there are moderates who disagree with him on things. listen, we have work to do, after losing a presidential election two cycles in a row, to a president that had a $16 trillion debt and an 8% unemployment rate, that's not good, so there are different views on how to get us back on tract. the good news is we control a good majority of the state legislatures and 30 out of the 50 governors are republicans. we have been gaining for the last four years. so i think we're winning in some areas. at the national level, we clearly have work to do. >> all right, and look, i have to give you credit. you came out, 30 of 50 governors. let me ask you, because of the talk about the civil war, the donald trump tweet about karl rove, here is what donald trump tweeted. karl rove's strategy and commercials were the worst i have ever seen. karl rove is a total loser. money given to him might as well be thrown down the drain.

other tea parties have criticized rove and said he's too moderate which has left me scratching my head because he used to be considered the bulwark of the republican party. who is the real republican? donald trump or karl rove, if you had to choose? >> i know both of them. they're all good republicans. we have good disagreements, just like the other side. when you lose after a presidential race, there's always this soul searching. i think it's healthy. what is our message? how are we going to appeal to those young voters and new voters and minority voters that we lost in big numbers this time? how are we going to change our tone? so that we are more effective messengers. and i think marco rubio is going to do a great job tomorrow night explaining the republican message to a broader audience. look, this is just part of the process. i'm not that worried about it. i don't call it a civil war. it's a disagreement in the family. and we'll be a stronger republican party going forward. >> do you think, though, when

you look at, let's say chris christie, could he actually get a nomination in the republican party given that he comes from a state that has some of the most restrictive, second most restrictive gun law in the country, that he is considered to be open-minded on things like gay marriage? he calls himself a republican, but it seems like looking at a republican primary, he would look like a flaming democrat. >> chris is a friend of mine. he's a darn good governor. he's got a 70-something percent approval rating in a blue state. i think people want results and not talk. plenty of rhetoric and talk and blame shifting in washington, and governors know how to get something done, so the answer is yes. we want to elect people and nominate people who are prince pale conservative but can win. i think you'll see more of that going forward. governors are good ones to lead the way. >> you have been talked about as a candidate for 2016. marco rubio seemed like a good

choice. you want to talk about immigration. you want to put out someone who is diverse. do you need rubio to be the nominee for the republican party to not become what the left-leaning "new republic" has just called the gop as the party of white people? >> well, i mean, that's grossly unfair. both parties have -- we're a majority white country. we're becoming more diverse. and i think that's a great thing. and our challenge is to be able to say why this conservative republican message gets results, why conservatism works and liberalism fails and why for the average person in america, why it produces things that are better for your family on taxes, on spending, education, on debt and deficit. this president has run into $16 trillion in debt, heading to $17 trillion, and a job rate that is

abysmal. the president has to explain how he's going to turn that around. marco rubio is a great guy to explain why that message is going to work. >> thank you. a girl who performed add the president's inauguration was gunned down in chicago. we have the latest developments in the hunt for her killer.

>> people are rightfully concerned about their participation as witnesses in this case or in any other case that involves a murder. >> chicago police say attacks against witnesses are actually rare, but people still believe they're in danger. >> i have to live here and my family lives here, so it would be a problem with me telling. >> because what could happen? >> because they would kill people. it's that dangerous out here. >> it is dangerous to do it. because you don't know who is watching and who knows you and what they're capable of doing. >> what could they do to you? >> they could shoot you or kill you. >> that's exactly what they did last april to 26-year-old kimberly harris, shot 20 times, three times in the face, just days before she was to testify against a gang member accused of killing her boyfriend. there were arrests in fewer than

40% of the 506 homicides in chicago last year, in many cases police simply couldn't get witnesses to tell them what happened. >> if we don't have those witnesses when we go to trial, how are we ever going to win our case? how are we ever going to hold that person responsible? >> we need the community to not be afraid to name them, to out them, to lure them in. >> father michael phleger has been preaching at st. sabina catholic church on chicago's south side for almost 30 years. >> we have to start reframing the way everything is talked about. you're going to be threatened. no, most likely you're not. you're a snitch. no, you're saving somebody else's life. >> it's already too late to save this life, one that had so much promise and was cut way too short. >> ted, of course, chicago, the president's, you know, his home town. he's going to be coming there on friday. he has been criticized by some for ignoring the violence in chicago. what do people hope he's going to do on friday?

>> i think specifically in the short term, erin, they're hoping he'll just extend the dialogue which was started by hadiya pendleton's death. her death has struck a nerve in this city like none other, at least for years. there's a real feel that people have had enough and there has to be something done. they hope the president coming here will continue that dialogue and there will be some resolve. >> ted, thank you very much. reporting from chicago tonight. still to come, the head of the lapd makes a surprising move, responding to christopher dorner's claims of racism. meanwhile, dorner is still being hunted down. plus, the attorney for a man involved in the penn state rape investigation called the case self-serving. [ nyquil bottle ] you know i relieve coughs, sneezing, fevers... [ tylenol bottle ] me too! and nasal co [ tissue box ] he said nasal congestion. yeah...i heard him. [ female announcer ] tylenol® cold multi-symptom nighttime relieves nasal congestion.

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welcome back to the second half of "outfront." we start with stories we care about where we focus on reporting from the front lines. we begin with benjamin netanyahu who said today that iran is getting closer to the infamous red line that you might recall he drew so bodily at the u.n. summit last winter. he said iran is, quote,

shortening the time needed to draw it. netanyahu is likely referring to iran's recent announcement that it intends to install advanced centrifuge machines at its enrichment facility. he said those machines are a lot more productive than the machines used now. >> a memorial was held for chris kyle who was shot by a fellow veteran he was trying to help. thousands attended the service at cowboy stadium for the man who called himself america's most lethal sniper. there were musical performances and tributes to kyle. the most emotional, though, came from his wife. she told the audience her husband was a warrior on and off the battlefield. those gearing up for spring break, watch out. shark attacks are at a decade high in the united states. there were 53 shark attacks in the united states last year. that's the most since 2000. 26 occurred in florida.

they tell us the uptick has to do with the human population, with so many people frequented the beaches, there are naturally going to be more attacks. >> it's been 557 days since the u.s. lost its top credit rating. what are we doing to get it back? jobs are key to the economic recovery. they said we have been making progress but warned a prosperous job market is going to take years to come. >> and now the paternos fighting back. a new report commissioned by the family called an investigation into the penn state sex scandal factually wrong, speculative and fundamentally wrong. they hired three experts to rebut the penn state report that claimed that paterno and three other officials famed to protect children from being abused by former coach jerry sandusky. hout front is jay paterno, and dick thornburg, one of three experts hired by the paterno family.

great to see both of you, and good to see you, jay. thank you so much for coming in. you have put a lot of time into this report. you feel that your father was wronged. this has become a cause for you. >> well, the report had a couple aims. one was to get to the ruth. and i think that's more important than anything. and a second thing is if we could also create some heightened level of awareness about nice guy predators. we felt that would be -- probably more important than anything. so had it really two things we were going after. >> now, nice guy predators, you're referring to people who may walk among us and we just have no idea. right? >> yeah, when i read jim clemente's report, i'm a father of five. and there were some things that really jumped out at me because if you would have asked me 18 months ago, what does a predator look like, i would have said the guy in the van cruising playground parking lots and school ground parking lots looking for kids, and that's not the case with nice guy predators. these guys are coaches, scout leaders, they're in your

communities. >> i want to ask both of you about things, give you a chance to respond in the louis freeh report. he said, and i want to quote him here from the report. mr. paterno was aware of the criminal 1998 investigation into sandusky's suspected child abuse. indeed, the evident shows that mr. paterno closely followed that case. later, in 2001, another one of his assistance, mike mcqueary, directly reported to mr. paterno that sandusky was sexually abusing a young boy in the locker room. the evidence shows that mr. paterno purposefully ignored the evidence. when you say walks among us, if you father knew in 1998, how does that add up? >> there is no evidence he did know in 1998. in fact, there are several men who testified under oath he was not told. as governor thornburg's report, it also states that the pennsylvania law at the time had a very high level of

confidentiality as it related to investigations and job sexual abuse, so that fact has not been established. in fact, there's a preponderance of the evidence that he was not aware. >> let me ask you this, louis freeh said there was an active attempt to conceal jerry sandusky's behavior. in 2001, the incident with mike mcqueary. louis freeh cites this exchange, an emil that was apparently between graham spanier and gary schultz and tim curley. he said after giving it more thought and talking it over with joe yesterday, i am uncomfortable with what we agreed were the next steps. i am having trouble with going to everyone, but the person involved. if he is cooperative, we would work with him to handle informing the organization. i would indicate that we feel there is a problem and we want to assist the individual get professional help. you're saying that e-mail doesn't add to to sufficient evidence that joe conspired to clear up the evidence.

some say after speaking to joe, they decided to back off. >> let me say two things. first of all, the accusation that mr. paterno tried to conceal anything that happened in 2001 is palpably false because he was the one who reported it to the administration and the people who had a responsibility for looking after those things. secondly, they have a difficult time distinguishing between y and we. if you read the e-mail carefully, you can see the things that are referred to as collective action and those as singular. it's a little bit technical, i'll admit, but when you have so little in the way of evidence available, you have to look at it carefully and come to the conclusion we did in the report. >> let me ask you, jay, about this, another thing said in the freeh record interesting in the fact that it was just talking about the spirit of what happened.

it said these men exhibited a striking lack of empathy for sandusky's victims by failing to inquire about their well being, especially by not even attempting to determine the identity of the child. do you have moments where you think about that and say, dad, were you thinking by not pushing it? >> you have to understand the time table. mike witnesses something on a friday. he talked to joe on a saturday. the most likely place this child would have come from was second mile, and tim curley went to the second mile, reported to the head of the second mile. he did attempt to find out who that child was. whether louis freeh thinks they should have gotten cars and driven around town, i don't know. you would have to ask him, but they did try to ascertain who it was. >> erin, one of the lessons we should learn from this is a negative lesson. not everybody should try to become a detective or a law enforcement official trying to uncover these things. there are experts who specialize in these areas. jim clemente, of course, is the best there is.

and when you -- and joe mentioned this in his observations, that he didn't want to upset what the professionals might do by mucking around as an amateur. i think tats a very important lesson to carry away. >> jay, i want to play, you and your mother sat down with katie couric. i wanted to play something your mother said today and give you a chance to respond to it. here see she is. >> let me ask you this, katie. adopted children, the experts, he had foster children. the experts vetted him. the executive director of second mile is a child psychologist. if the experts don't know, how can we know? >> i mean, she has a fair point, but when mike mcqueary comes and tells your dad he saw what he saw, do you think he would have done it differently? >> knowing what we know now about jerry sandusky, and we

have to be very careful when you judge think things in historical perspective. at the time mike went to joe, what he told him was not very specific, by mike's own admission, and what we knew about jerry sandusky at the time was this guy was a pillar of the community. he had started a charity that really helps thousands of kids. everything would point you away from believing that. when you read jim clemente's report, part of the psychology of this is nice guy predators do everything they can to turn you away from their actions and fool you. so yeah, there were a lot of people fooled. i worked with jerry sandusky for five years, i have known him my whole life. >> did you hear any of those allegations? >> i'm one of those people who were fooled. reading that report now, if anything, people should read those reports as parents, as investigators. >> thank you very much. i hope people will read it. thank you very much. now to our fourth story "outfront." charged with murder.

today, authorities in california formally charged christopher dorner with the murder of a police officer and the attempted murder of three other officers. dorner is the former lapd officer who please say has been on the run since last week. there's now a $1 million reward for information leading to his capture. but it appears the trail has gone cold after his pickup truck was found last thursday engulfed in flames near the resort community of big bear lake. he said his revenge of the law enforcement is due to his firing in 2008, and now the lapd is looking into the firing and his charges of racism. kyung lah is out front with the story. >> it's the front page. >> front page. >> compton, los angeles, long beach, and inglewood. >> this is not murder, this is war. >> it debate rages on l.a. radio. christopher dorner, cop killer or vigilante hero? >> i believe what he is doing is really no different than our ancestors would have done and

did do in fighting to get free. >> not that people don't have a right to be angry. it's what you do about the angry. >> it's awful that we have to buy into that as another african-american. >> online, a more bold following, with numerous facebook fan pages, one even called a christopher dorner appreciation society. where does this come from? l.a.'s old wounds, as acknowledged by l.a.'s police chief as he reopened the investigation into dorner's firing. >> i hear the ghosts of the past of the los angeles police department. i hear people saying maybe there is something to what he says. i want to put that to rest. if there is anything to what we says or anything new he brings up in his manifesto, we will deal with it and deal with it in a public history. 1965, the riots triggered by the stop of a black man by white police officers. 1991, the brutal beating of rodney king.

the april acquittal of an all-white jury of all of the officers of assault spurned days of riots in los angeles, and in the late '90s, the rampart scandal. the u.s. department of justice came in to reform the entire police department. >> lapd's relationship with the black community could only be described as a state of war. >> this woman sued the lapd representing hundreds of minority officers and helped change the department. today, minorities make up more than half of lapd's force and it has a new mindset. >> what do you think of the chief reopening the investigation? >> i think it was a tough decision made for the exact right reasons. the openly racist culture of lapd of 30 years ago is gone. >> rice is now the police chief's trusted adviser. she says dorner's beef with the lapd may well be real. but he remains a suspected

killer. >> let's not merge the path with cadets. and let's separate out the possibility that mr. dorner has raised legitimate issues from the complete illegitimacy and obscenity of what he's done. >> the police chief says the reopening of the dorner firing investigation isn't to appease the fugitive but a way to continue to close wounds and take another step away from its painful past. kyung lah, cnn, los angeles. "outfront" tonight, we go to rio, where carnival is in full swing. why an american mormon says her parents would kill her if they knew what she was up to. and ted nugent invited to attend president obama's state of the union address. when we went to his ranch, he had this to say to the president.

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we are back with tonight's outer circle where we reach out to our sources around the world, and tonight, a special report from brazil. carnival is in full swing. you know what that means. not a lot of clothes, but a lot of fun. samba is a centerpiece of the revelry complete with thumping music and sweaty, sequinned bodies. we follow an american dancer who is breaking tradition to be a big part of the celebration in rio. >> tiny jeweled bikinis and gyrating hips. just what you would expect from rio de janeiro's raucous carnival, but not necessarily from a mormon born and raised in salem, oregon. this woman and her friends apply glitter and baby oil before they climb on a three-story float depicting noah's ark. >> we'll be climbing up the ladder in our platform heels and our tiny costumes, climbing up to line noah's ark, and this is my headdress. >> they'll have to dance samba to a pounding beat for two or three hours. i asked mandy and her friends

what their biggest concern is. >> falling off, actually. >> it's high. >> before the parade, we visited mandy at a gym where she took samba lessons for eight months, learning to dance in platforms and swing her hips like a pro. mandy's husband, an american businessman, was transferred to rio less than a year ago, and she soon discovered the classes. when her teacher said she was good enough to participate in carnival, she signed up. then she got a look at the costume. >> my parents are going to kill me. >> rio's annual carnival is a huge event in brazil. a million tourists come to town and the big attraction is the parade. this is the moment that mandy has been waiting for and training for for eight months. up ahead, she's going to head into the samba drone and parade in front of 172,000 people and millions more around the globe. cnn, rio de janeiro.

and now our fifth story out front. ted nugent headed for washington. he will be in attendance at president obama's state of the union address. he will not bring any of his weapons to the ranch, they will be banned they talked about hunting, they talked about self-defense and they talked about his beloved second amendment. >> fire in the hole. >> for ted nugent, gun control is putting the second bullet in the same hole as the first. >> two down. >> a lot of people look at the tragedy at sandy hook and they say, something's got to be done. >> agreed, something has to be done. >> they point to weapons that were used as the cause. >> it's not the weapons. the weapons have nothing to do with it. these -- again, these weapons are in every pickup truck in texas.

♪ >> the famed platinum selling rocker is passionate about his music, his family, and his firearms. he's fiercely protective of the rights of law abiding gun owners and he's invited us to his 300 acre ranch in waco, texas, to explain why. >> i'll give you some real eye candy in a second. >> we see wild turkey and black buck antelope. all fair game during hunting season. like tens of millions of americans, nugent grew up hunting with his dad and brothers. guns are a family tradition he has avidly passed on to his wife and kids. if somebody close to you were killed by a gunman, would your views on guns change? >> absolutely not. no, i would never turn against this wonderful tool that brings me self-defense capabilities and brings me great joy and competition and marksmanship training. deb, you climb up this platform. >> i'm trying to understand the

nature of the hunt. >> when i get up here, i'm not kidding you, i do 79 concerts and i get up here, strap myself in, take a deep breath and sit here for six hours. >> so it's meditative to you. >> absolute meditation. >> have you ever tried yoga? >> i think this is the supreme yoga. >> nugent's passion about guns and his unyielding belief in the second amendment's right to bear arms has transformed him into the somewhat fanatical face of the nra. >> boy, you are a city girl. you stand kind of like you're golfing. >> i am a city girl. >> you squeeze that trigger. >> as he teaches me gun safety, he repeatedly emphasizes that gun violence is caused by criminals, the mentally ill, and a legal system that paroles criminals too soon. the argument that was made is he

was allowed to kill as many people as he did because it had multiple bullets and he was able to just keep firing. >> deb, the rate of fire in all of these mass shootings, it's not a matter of bullets or fire power. a quail gun in the wrong hands is as deadly as this gun. people have got to come to that reality. >> the ability to defend his family is something he takes very, very seriously. >> when i'm being assaulted at my home, i and i alone, by any consideration whatsoever, will determine how many bullets i need to protect my family. >> nugent has been a sheriff's deputy for 30 years and carries a concealed glock at all times. so i want you and i to solve this problem of gun violence. >> there is no gun violence. there is criminal violence, and they use an assortment of tools. >> let's talk about background checks. >> i like background checks.

>> yes, but not at gun shows or with private sales. a lot of people in law enforcement have to take a psychological exam before they're allowed to carry. why not normal citizens. >> i wrote "wango tango," and i carry a gun. ♪ >> nugent sticks to his guns, literally. for him, the second amendment is nonnegotiable. >> america, i'm ted nugent and these are all legal guns, and i'm going to see that they remain legal because they're all good. tattoos are next. [ male announcer] surprise -- you're having triplets.

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wow-a grt deal just got a whole lot better. ♪ (train horn) vo: wherever our trains go, the economy comes to life. norfolk southern. one line, infinite possibilities. for more than 20 years. vinny meyers produced more than 10,000 traditional tattoos. but now he spends most of his time helping breast cancer survivors. some of the following images may not be appropriate for all audiences, but we felt they're

necessary to tell this important story. >> your nipple reconstruction is about perfect. >> it's the best. >> that's how you want it to be. >> absolutely. >> unfortunately all the other women in the country are walking around with nipples reconstructed that don't look like that. >> for many women breast reconstruction is part of the healing process. >> that looks good. really good. >> vinny meyers specializes in tattoos nippling onto women who have had breast cancer surgery, using precisely mixed pigments, he creates a 3-d illusion of the real thing. >> the standard has been draw a circle and color it in. when they asked me to do it, it's a no-brainer, you're going to make the nipple look like a nipple. that's the idea. whatever you can do to make it look as realistic as possible. it's surprising to me that's been overlooked all this time. >> vinny started tattooing when he was a u.s. army medic in south korea back in the 1980s.

>> my friend richie would get these guys to come get tattooed and we would split the money. it was a fair source of income at that time. >> he liked it so much, he decided to make a career out of it. he opened up a shop in maryland tattooing the usual dragons and cross bones. never did he dream that one day he would use his love of tattoos to solve a problem that has eluded theorld's best surgeons for years. >> when i had the opportunity to do a portrait of a nipple on a lady, i did, and it changed things in the industry a little bit, i think. >> for susan mcmillon, he's also erased some of the taboo around tattoos. >> my parents always said you will never have a tattoo. do not come home with a tattoo. i then told my children over my dead body will you have a tattoo. and of course i have to laugh because i have the tattoos now. and i love it. piers morgan tonight is next. brother's keeper.

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